"I believe that spiritual maturity is not the ability to see the extraordinary, but the ability to see the ordinary through God's eyes. Consequently, no matter how wonderful our experience or encounter is with God, the test of it's worth is in the fruit it bears in our lives and the lives of others. " - Frank Viola
Wednesday, March 4, 2009
Your "Dream" Church...
From studying Scripture, what components of "the church" would you include and embrace in the makeup of your dream church?
One must take action or be active, do there own part, pull there own weight. This can be worded in many different ways. But bottom line all members need to contribute some how way or form. There is no limit or boundries how this can be displayed or excersized. Dead weight has no purpose
I think it starts with the enlightened acknowledgement that the Jesus described in the bible no longer can fit in the box that we have allowed Him to traditionally dwell for so long... and somehow piecing together the way the old and new covenants are being and have been fulfilled. Their is a beautiful freedom that comes with Christ not abolishing the law but ful-filling it... Its as if God was saying the appropriate thing for the approriate time - I mean imagine if Christ had shown up when the Israelites were still slaves in Egypt, not having the Mosaic Law yet established, not being oppressed by the religious leaders representing that law - the message of grace may have never been clear - but God's timing is always perfect. Picture it like this:
Without his mother knowing it a toddler has wondered across the street during a busy time of day. She suddenly notices the tiny child out of her reach. The boy carelessly begins to tread in her direction with cars racing to and fro all around....in the comotion she calls out desperately,"Stop! Don't move!"
She waits patiently for what seems forever, noticing the traffic fade out she exclaims,"Now son, run to mommy! Hurry!"
If we take the two simple sentences that the mother exclaimed and place them side by side without the story in between they completely contradict themselves - however the details that make up the body of the story help us to realize the importance of each of the things the mother was exclaiming, and adding all the more emphasis and value on the last phrase yelled at her stranded litte boy.
Somehow being able to find the balance of grace covering over the law with the justification of Christ, I believe, will help us begin the process of discovering exactly what Christ wanted for us here on earth. Not to say that we no longer believe in the old testament, or that God has changed, He has always been the same, but to acknowledge that the dawn of a new representation of that amazing God may be approaching.... but how do we describe it in such a way that it provokes action?
Jese’s Dream Church (Not necessarily in order of importance…)
Equal treatment of women in all aspects of the Kingdom of God
Brothers and sisters struggling, succeeding, and sharing the compassion of Christ together rooted in deep relationships, fostered through community, accountability and confession.
All members of God’s family help to create and embody the atmosphere of love and acceptance by co-teaching, honoring fellow family members different places in their own personal journey, yet striving to stretch and mold our own lives into that of Christ - through respect, peace, and grace.
Children will be allowed to participate in all aspects of the community, in order to help foster their own journey with the Trinity as well as fellow members of the Bride. No matter how distracting, they will always be dealt with in love, gentleness, peace, and patience. In doing so we allow ourselves to remember where we have once come from as well as Christ’s own words, “Whatsoever you do unto the least….you do unto Me.”
We strive to swiftly end poverty, injustice, and cruelty to our fellow man/woman by paying special attention to the organizations, companies, and department stores we support. While focusing heavily on the oppression that exists in our own communities by trying to lighten their load in whatever capacity God has gifted us, we do not forget that loving our neighbor extends past our local communities into the foreign and abandoned parts of the world.
Standing for the Non-violent Jesus, striving for the separation of Church and State, and when we exclaim, “PRO LIFE” , we actually mean all life. Not supporting war and using God to further political agendas. And not just saying that someone can’t have an abortion, but saying that we are willing to take your unwanted babies. By noting that we must first fix our family problems ( I.e. evangelicals have the highest divorce rate than any other group of people) before we fix everyone else’s. Noting that sin is a natural struggle in this life, and that all sins must be dealt with through the eyes of Christ.
Well I feel blessed that I had pretty darn close to, if not my dream church in college. I went to Christ the King Lutheran Church, which was the sister church on the college campus to Zion Lutheran Church in Mt Pleasant, MI where my college was located. They had early church at Zion and a later service at Christ the King. Zion had a pastor and Christ the King had a pastor, but they took turns preaching at both churches each week. Therefore, I was able to hear the preaching of two different pastors, both of which I liked. On Sundays we had a traditional church service, but on Monday nights at the college church we also had a contemporary service with praise and worship music. I usually went to both because I like both kinds of services. This is one thing I would want in my dream church, the option to worship in both a traditional and contemporary manner.
Another thing I loved about this church and would want in my dream church is wide range of ages that attended. We had elderly people, people my parent’s age, young couples, college aged, youth, and children of all ages. At this church I felt I had people who acted like grandparents, parents, aunts and uncles, brothers and sisters, and friends to me. Not to mention I love children and I always had little ones wanting to play with me after church. The church was my family! I made my closest friends in that church. Friends I will most likely have for the rest of my life even though I live 100s of miles away from them now. I knew that I could go to any number of these people when I was in need and that I could count on them to help.
At Christ the King we had a college age Christian fellowship group called Lutheran Student Fellowship. In high school my church back home didn’t have a very strong youth group, so when I went to college and found this fellowship group it was exactly what I was looking for. Within this group I found wonderful true friends to share and grow in my relationship with God. We had bible studies both pastor let and student led. We did outreach on the college campus such as: having a BBQ and giving out free hot dogs on move in day, handing out free lemonade and hot chocolate, delivering goodie bags around exam time and hosting different events. We did volunteer work in the community and on the college campus. We raised money for and participated in cancer walks, and bowl-a-thons for cystic fibrosis. We hosted lock-ins for the youth of our church and did other events such as hayrides and Halloween carnivals for the little ones. We went on mission trips and went to National Lutheran Student Fellowship Conventions. I found the mission trips we went on to be the most rewarding. The three trips I was able to go on were all down south after the hurricanes. We went to Biloxi, MS twice and worked on a number of different things such as: cleaning up debris, laying a foundation, drywall mudding, and tearing up and re-shingling a roof. We also went on a trip to New Orleans where we gutted moldy damaged houses. Each trip was very unique and I feel blessed to have had those experiences. We also had a number of fellowship events as a group just to get to know each other better and to have a non-threatening way to bring others to events and hopefully witness to them.
I realize I did not answer this question in the same way as others but I felt it was a way to share my wonderful experience with you all. I am not sure if I figured out how to make it post under my name, so just in case you are wondering this is Emilie.
So, sorry it has taken me till now to get around to blogging. My dream church: A lot of what I would like to see has been discussed on Sunday evenings and through other conversations. Also, by taking part in traditional church and YWAM (Youth With A Mission, and observing. I love the idea of deep-nit relationships; where you feel you belong and are family. Having the kids around to participate is so important-maybe with them being so involved at such young ages we can encourage them for the positive and maybe they would be less likely to wonder. Being involved in the community-knowing hurts, needs, prayers, debts, etc... Helping the orphans and widows with however we are able to do that. Having an abundance of grace, openness, trust and discernment-there should be no condemnation of a people and their sexual preference (love the person hate the sin). We all have sinned and fallen short. Having a firm foundation in what we believe and where we stand. Knowing scripture, studying as we feel led, and prayer (so so important). Being in tune with God and not straying from where He is leading and being able to discern what each other is hearing (seeking God in all we do). Having some friendship evangelism-not preaching to people, but building sound relationships and leading by example. Building bridges between denominations and keeping in mind that everyone is our neighbor. Sharing with one another and living a simplified life (when I was in YWAM for 6 months we were only allowed to bring one backpack-thank goodness we were able to trade our clothes around. When I got back I was ready to get rid of a crap load of stuff, because at some point you realize you can survive on a lot less.) I believe that having a prayer room set up some where is a very beneficial and important element. Probably one of the coolest God experience I have ever had was in a prayer room in Northern Ireland-I had been crying and just seeking out God. There was a hot sensation right under my eye and God totally was wiping away my tear.
Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola and George Barna
Evil and The Justice of God by N.T. Wright
Hurt People Hurt People by Sandra Wilson
12 Marks of a New Monasticism
Followers
The Users of Sweat Shops are:
Nike, Phillips-Van Heusen, Disney, Guess?, The Gap, Banana Republic, Old Navy, Tommy Hilfiger, Reebok, Levi Straus, Liz Claiborne, Ralph Lauren, Mattel,Wal-Mart, Roohsing(Hong Kong clothing company), Kohl's
How are these employees treated? These employees are far from being paid well. They DO NOT even get paid enough to survive on. They also do not get the right to form unions and do not get any benefits. *These people are basically slaves, they are scared into staying, they are paid very, very low wages or nothing at all, and are denied basic benefits and worker's rights(in some cases human rights too).*
How do we fight this form of slavery?
Simply by not financially supporting companies and organizations that use sweat shops and slave labor to produce their products.
Help to stand against this terrible act on our neighbors, support agencies trying to free these people, and support companies who sell products made by freed victims (www.madebysurvivors.com)
One must take action or be active, do there own part, pull there own weight. This can be worded in many different ways. But bottom line all members need to contribute some how way or form. There is no limit or boundries how this can be displayed or excersized. Dead weight has no purpose
ReplyDeleteI think it starts with the enlightened acknowledgement that the Jesus described in the bible no longer can fit in the box that we have allowed Him to traditionally dwell for so long... and somehow piecing together the way the old and new covenants are being and have been fulfilled. Their is a beautiful freedom that comes with Christ not abolishing the law but ful-filling it... Its as if God was saying the appropriate thing for the approriate time - I mean imagine if Christ had shown up when the Israelites were still slaves in Egypt, not having the Mosaic Law yet established, not being oppressed by the religious leaders representing that law - the message of grace may have never been clear - but God's timing is always perfect. Picture it like this:
ReplyDeleteWithout his mother knowing it a toddler has wondered across the street during a busy time of day. She suddenly notices the tiny child out of her reach. The boy carelessly begins to tread in her direction with cars racing to and fro all around....in the comotion she calls out desperately,"Stop! Don't move!"
She waits patiently for what seems forever, noticing the traffic fade out she exclaims,"Now son, run to mommy! Hurry!"
If we take the two simple sentences that the mother exclaimed and place them side by side without the story in between they completely contradict themselves - however the details that make up the body of the story help us to realize the importance of each of the things the mother was exclaiming, and adding all the more emphasis and value on the last phrase yelled at her stranded litte boy.
Somehow being able to find the balance of grace covering over the law with the justification of Christ, I believe, will help us begin the process of discovering exactly what Christ wanted for us here on earth. Not to say that we no longer believe in the old testament, or that God has changed, He has always been the same, but to acknowledge that the dawn of a new representation of that amazing God may be approaching.... but how do we describe it in such a way that it provokes action?
Jese’s Dream Church (Not necessarily in order of importance…)
ReplyDeleteEqual treatment of women in all aspects of the Kingdom of God
Brothers and sisters struggling, succeeding, and sharing the compassion of Christ together rooted in deep relationships, fostered through community, accountability and confession.
All members of God’s family help to create and embody the atmosphere of love and acceptance by co-teaching, honoring fellow family members different places in their own personal journey, yet striving to stretch and mold our own lives into that of Christ - through respect, peace, and grace.
Children will be allowed to participate in all aspects of the community, in order to help foster their own journey with the Trinity as well as fellow members of the Bride. No matter how distracting, they will always be dealt with in love, gentleness, peace, and patience. In doing so we allow ourselves to remember where we have once come from as well as Christ’s own words, “Whatsoever you do unto the least….you do unto Me.”
We strive to swiftly end poverty, injustice, and cruelty to our fellow man/woman by paying special attention to the organizations, companies, and department stores we support. While focusing heavily on the oppression that exists in our own communities by trying to lighten their load in whatever capacity God has gifted us, we do not forget that loving our neighbor extends past our local communities into the foreign and abandoned parts of the world.
Standing for the Non-violent Jesus, striving for the separation of Church and State, and when we exclaim, “PRO LIFE” , we actually mean all life. Not supporting war and using God to further political agendas. And not just saying that someone can’t have an abortion, but saying that we are willing to take your unwanted babies. By noting that we must first fix our family problems ( I.e. evangelicals have the highest divorce rate than any other group of people) before we fix everyone else’s. Noting that sin is a natural struggle in this life, and that all sins must be dealt with through the eyes of Christ.
The perfect church… the perfect church is not an organization but rather an organism. It is a single body composed of many different individuals that fulfill their own various functions for the betterment of the whole. It is a community of believers that strive to see things in the same manner as Jesus. It is a family, quite dysfunctional yet it is a family in which brotherly love never dies. It serves God religiously without religiously serving God. Without dissimulation it manifest the fruit of Christ to this hungry world. It inspires hope in the hopeless, gives love to the loveless and grace to those who don’t deserve it. It understands that it is not a social club for the righteous but rather a place where sick souls go to get well. It embraces the ideals of equality and unity of self denial and love. It is under the sole authority of Christ and does not embrace the empty traditions of men. It seeks peace in all conflict, and an end to all hostility. It abides by the old cliché that we are to treat others in the same manner as we would want to be treated. It believes that love is more than an abstract notion but rather a practical way of life.
ReplyDeleteWell I feel blessed that I had pretty darn close to, if not my dream church in college. I went to Christ the King Lutheran Church, which was the sister church on the college campus to Zion Lutheran Church in Mt Pleasant, MI where my college was located. They had early church at Zion and a later service at Christ the King. Zion had a pastor and Christ the King had a pastor, but they took turns preaching at both churches each week. Therefore, I was able to hear the preaching of two different pastors, both of which I liked. On Sundays we had a traditional church service, but on Monday nights at the college church we also had a contemporary service with praise and worship music. I usually went to both because I like both kinds of services. This is one thing I would want in my dream church, the option to worship in both a traditional and contemporary manner.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing I loved about this church and would want in my dream church is wide range of ages that attended. We had elderly people, people my parent’s age, young couples, college aged, youth, and children of all ages. At this church I felt I had people who acted like grandparents, parents, aunts and uncles, brothers and sisters, and friends to me. Not to mention I love children and I always had little ones wanting to play with me after church. The church was my family! I made my closest friends in that church. Friends I will most likely have for the rest of my life even though I live 100s of miles away from them now. I knew that I could go to any number of these people when I was in need and that I could count on them to help.
At Christ the King we had a college age Christian fellowship group called Lutheran Student Fellowship. In high school my church back home didn’t have a very strong youth group, so when I went to college and found this fellowship group it was exactly what I was looking for. Within this group I found wonderful true friends to share and grow in my relationship with God. We had bible studies both pastor let and student led. We did outreach on the college campus such as: having a BBQ and giving out free hot dogs on move in day, handing out free lemonade and hot chocolate, delivering goodie bags around exam time and hosting different events. We did volunteer work in the community and on the college campus. We raised money for and participated in cancer walks, and bowl-a-thons for cystic fibrosis. We hosted lock-ins for the youth of our church and did other events such as hayrides and Halloween carnivals for the little ones. We went on mission trips and went to National Lutheran Student Fellowship Conventions. I found the mission trips we went on to be the most rewarding. The three trips I was able to go on were all down south after the hurricanes. We went to Biloxi, MS twice and worked on a number of different things such as: cleaning up debris, laying a foundation, drywall mudding, and tearing up and re-shingling a roof. We also went on a trip to New Orleans where we gutted moldy damaged houses. Each trip was very unique and I feel blessed to have had those experiences. We also had a number of fellowship events as a group just to get to know each other better and to have a non-threatening way to bring others to events and hopefully witness to them.
I realize I did not answer this question in the same way as others but I felt it was a way to share my wonderful experience with you all. I am not sure if I figured out how to make it post under my name, so just in case you are wondering this is Emilie.
Emilie’s Post
So, sorry it has taken me till now to get around to blogging. My dream church: A lot of what I would like to see has been discussed on Sunday evenings and through other conversations. Also, by taking part in traditional church and YWAM (Youth With A Mission, and observing.
ReplyDeleteI love the idea of deep-nit relationships; where you feel you belong and are family. Having the kids around to participate is so important-maybe with them being so involved at such young ages we can encourage them for the positive and maybe they would be less likely to wonder.
Being involved in the community-knowing hurts, needs, prayers, debts, etc... Helping the orphans and widows with however we are able to do that.
Having an abundance of grace, openness, trust and discernment-there should be no condemnation of a people and their sexual preference (love the person hate the sin). We all have sinned and fallen short.
Having a firm foundation in what we believe and where we stand. Knowing scripture, studying as we feel led, and prayer (so so important).
Being in tune with God and not straying from where He is leading and being able to discern what each other is hearing (seeking God in all we do).
Having some friendship evangelism-not preaching to people, but building sound relationships and leading by example.
Building bridges between denominations and keeping in mind that everyone is our neighbor.
Sharing with one another and living a simplified life (when I was in YWAM for 6 months we were only allowed to bring one backpack-thank goodness we were able to trade our clothes around. When I got back I was ready to get rid of a crap load of stuff, because at some point you realize you can survive on a lot less.)
I believe that having a prayer room set up some where is a very beneficial and important element. Probably one of the coolest God experience I have ever had was in a prayer room in Northern Ireland-I had been crying and just seeking out God. There was a hot sensation right under my eye and God totally was wiping away my tear.